Reply to "Was Mary really a virgin?"

[Kill You]

No one has to have a child at all, if they choose not too. ..Well my mom had 3 abortions so that makes me against my mom according to ur statement.

Please answer the questions I ask without going around them or claiming things that are not true.

I was born and raised in Canada (North America) just like you and other members, so my thoughts are the same and I live the same as you. I have a Canadian mentality.

I didn't exactly mean it negative towards you at all, sorry if it seemed that way. Didn't mean to go around your question either...why can't gays mate you ask? Well because their sex organs are the same and therefore they cannot reproduce, no. But they can make love.

The point I was trying to make is that Jesus was supposed to be about "love everyone" right? Well, that's useless if love everyone only means love the people who believe in you or are straight. Do you think Jesus would be like "ew, get out of here faggot" to someone because they were gay? No, I would hope he'd love them just the same. Do YOU personally think it's okay for people to go to Hell just because they were born un-attracted to the opposite sex? I would hope any good Christian would actually say no to that question.

Once again I'm not trying to offend just having a debate.

[Kill You]

Go to hell for that? Of course not and anyone who thinks that is poisoned by Religion.

What I am trying to say is why cant gays/lesbians have children like a male and a female? It could very well be that they are not supposed to and these are the signs I was explaining about in the Bible.

I understand there is a scientific explanation for this but 1400 years ago there was no science like there is today.

But that's what it says in the Bible. If you're gay you go to Hell.

It could very well be that they're not supposed to like you said...but why does that matter? As I said having children isn't a requirement for life. Once you're born it's up to you to pass on your genes or not. For the record though gays can still have children, it's call surrogates. It's not like a gay man can't impregnate a woman or a gay woman can't get pregnant.

[BigBoss]

But thats the thing Religion has the proof it has been written many and many years ago

How do u know it did for sure? That was so long ago and someone could have just wrote it somewhere and said it existed?

lol.

Back to this

[SliK]

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

This one is by far my favorite and it was the one I came to post.

And let's not forget Leviticus:

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is an abomination.(Leviticus 18:22 KJV) If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.(Leviticus 20:13 KJV))

[SliK]

Tell me about it

[Kill You]

Doesn't say SHIT about women lying with other women though so lesbians do go to Heaven. Especially the hot naughty ones.

[Kill You]

EDIT: Jesus defended that woman who committed adultery by saying: he who is without sin may cast the first stone (or something like that, I know it in Arabic better), so wouldn't he have defended homos as well?!

I would like to think so.

[RoleModel'Est96]

Yeah, all of the Holy Books are open interpretation, imo.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think in the Holy Qu'ran there is a story about either the city of Medina or Mecca (I forgot ) and it was really corrupt in which soldiers would rape the inhabitants and there was an occasion where the soldier had raped a man. I believe this is the only reference to homosexuality in the Qu'ran. Therefore some Muslims may look at the story and believe it condemns Homosexuality, whereas some people may look at it as if the story is condemning rape.
I think the most important thing in religion is the relationship you have with God/s depending if its a monotheist or polytheist relgion.

[Kill You]

When we say re-written we mean like translated.

[classthe_king]

I just read that other thread..

how did Mary have a child and still be a virgin?! GOD that's how. God can do anything he chooses. And yes Jesus proved that further, with all the miracles he has done, heeling the blind, the paralyzed, exorcising a possessed human, turning water into wine etc...

and @class, so what if the bible was translated, if I said: "Bonjour, quelle est ton nom?" or "Good Day, What is your name?" what difference does it make?

Like a big star exploding and creating life forms from it's particles is more reasonable...

That was simply proof that the book is not exactly in it's original state.
And considering that's what actually happened and that's what the evidence supports, yes that is much more reasonable.

[classthe_king]

Evidence from who and where?

From physicists and other people who actually know what they're talking about

If someone wants to read the Bible and speak a different language that is great it is in many languages.

So what, what does this have to do with anything.

[TripleNineThree]

1. "The Bible was translated therefore is not reliable" - Wrong. The text of the Bible is actually much more reliable than other ancient texts from that time. We have thousands upon thousands of Greek texts from as early as 25 years after they were originally written, this is AMAZING for an ancient text. Do some research. The English Bibles we currently have, are translated from the greek papyrus scrolls that are from that 25 year mark. As far as the Old Testament goes, when they discovered the Dead Sea Scrolls (Do some research if you don't know what that is) our manuscripts matched those almost perfectly. ALSO, the New Testament authors quoted EVERY SINGLE book of the Old Testament in their letters/gospels. What they quoted, we have almost the same exact text. Saying that since the Bible was translated makes it unreliable, is a very ignorant statement to say.

2. Was Mary a virgin? Well, if one has the presupposition that God exists, then how would it be hard to believe that Mary could be a virgin? Now, if you come into it believing there is no God, then obviously you won't believe this statement. Jesus fulfilled over 300 prophecies from the Old Testament down to the smallest details, INCLUDING virgin birth.

3. For those saying Jesus never existed. That is the most historically ignorant and foolish statement I read throughout this entire debate section. Don't think you're smart simply because you're an atheist. That is a really stupid statement.

4. Conclusion, yes Mary was a virgin but if your presupposition is that there is no God, obviously you won't believe that.


I don't like debating religion but there was far too much people saying stuff without doing any research about it.

EDIT One more interesting fact. Scientists for years believed that the universe didn't have a beginning, that it always just was. The term "Big Bang" was actually coined by a man making fun of those who held to the "religious" belief that the universe had a beginning as described in Genesis (In the beginning...). Evidence then pointed that galaxies were expanding from a central point, therefore pointing to the fact that the universe had a beginning. The vast majority of scientists rejected this on philosophical grounds. Now it's treated as a fact.

[classthe_king]

2. Was Mary a virgin? Well, if one has the presupposition that God exists, then how would it be hard to believe that Mary could be a virgin? Now, if you come into it believing there is no God, then obviously you won't believe this statement. Jesus fulfilled over 300 prophecies from the Old Testament down to the smallest details, INCLUDING virgin birth.

That's a ridiculous presupposition that no one should take blindly. He fulfilled over 300 prophecies? Bullshit. He fulfilled a bunch of vague statements that you could bend to make anyone fill. Plus it's not hard to make someone fulfill prophecies when you're making the story up and you know what prophecies he needs to fulfill.

Also, there were many prophecies in the bible that were not fulfilled.

3. For those saying Jesus never existed. That is the most historically ignorant and foolish statement I read throughout this entire debate section. Don't think you're smart simply because you're an atheist. That is a really stupid statement.

No it's not. It's the only reasonable historically accurate stance you can take. I'm not saying he definitely didn't exist but we don't know if he did or not. None of the historical documents were written while Jesus was alive. Most of them were written much later, by almost two generations. In fact, none of the prominent Jewish scholars alive in Jerusalem during the time of Jesus said a word about Jesus. I find that weird that one can come back from the dead and no one even bats and eye.

4. Conclusion, yes Mary was a virgin but if your presupposition is that there is no God, obviously you won't believe that.

Because it's ridiculous and impossible

I don't like debating religion but there was far too much people saying stuff without doing any research about it.

That's ironic.

EDIT One more interesting fact. Scientists for years believed that the universe didn't have a beginning, that it always just was. The term "Big Bang" was actually coined by a man making fun of those who held to the "religious" belief that the universe had a beginning as described in Genesis (In the beginning...). Evidence then pointed that galaxies were expanding from a central point, therefore pointing to the fact that the universe had a beginning. The vast majority of scientists rejected this on philosophical grounds. Now it's treated as a fact.

No that's wrong. Scientists still believe that the universe never had a beginning. Most scientists believe the big bang was just a way of the universe to collapse on itself and then expand again in a cyclical pattern.

[classthe_king]

Pretty sure there are enough documents that support that there was a person named Jesus who fit his criteria back then.

There's not though

[classthe_king]

I know I am